El Lefty Malo is AWESOME! Read his post on what he thought the Giants need to do.
And the Giants appeared to listen to him, though not to the letter (sub Tejada for Cabrera) by DFAing Rowand and Tejada. Arguably, this is a bigger message sent since Tejada is paid a lot more than Cabrera. But I think his open pouting and discussion of such regarding the bunt helped Giants management push the button easier on that one.
Rowand's lack of production made his release an easy one, $14M or not, as Baggarly reported that he was openly campaigning for getting out of SF, a circumstance that probably made the decision for Giants management that much more obvious as well. He has reached the true point of "sunk costs": at least last season he was a viable talent off the bench, producing some value as a player, and for the first half of this season, but for a number of months now he has been even worse than replacement value.
They were clearly "addition by subtraction" type of moves. That's nearly $20M wrote off, so Zito could be gone sometime next season as well if he's not producing or even if he's not in the starting rotation, since the Giants could go with Lincecum, Cain, Bumgarner, Sanchez, Vogelsong in the rotation.
Sabean says that he will try to trade both of them today so that they can hook on with a playoff contending team; Rowand is hoping to rejoin the Phillies, but I don't see the Giants doing that one, I don't think that they want to see him haunting them in any way. I also don't see any team wanting to even give up a low level prospect for either of them, much cleaner to wait for the end of the 10-day period and sign them then. Nobody will be crying that they didn't pick these players up in time to make the playoff roster, as defiant as Tejada's statement was the other day about contributing to somebody's playoff efforts. But if Renteria can get a job somewhere, I'm sure Tejada will as well.
Meanwhile, the Giants activated Pat Burrell and purchased the contract of Brett Pill, rewarding his great season so far in AAA, plus his willingness to play a number of different positions. As much as I would hope that Pill mashes, the history of players his age who hit well but not that great in AAA is not encouraging, they normally don't come up here and do much of anything. But I wish him all the success he can get, and who knows, he could be the exception to prove the rule. I certainly would not have thought that Crawford could keep his strikeout rate so low in the majors, or his walk rate so high, so there's always that.
I assume part of this move was to enable Burrell to be available for the playoffs should we be able to fight our way in. And at this point, you roll the dice and see what you got with Pill, there is really no one else high in the system worth that shot.
Baggarly also noted that there is still an open 40-man spot with this move. That opens up the possibility of bringing up another player, such as Bill Hall or Marc Kroon. Sentimentally, I would go with Kroon, but objectively, Hall is probably the more logical move because he can play multiple positions and has been hitting OK in the minors, though not great, at least if he were still a major league caliber hitter. If he were, he should have been killing the ball. Still, he's been a major leaguer, and it wasn't that long ago that he was hitting OK (last season), so you might want to take a chance on that. But at this point, I would go with Kroon, would make great story, might juice the clubhouse by his inspirational story, which Hall would not provide.
Nice offense today, just what this team needs, 4 runs, that is all we ask for, daily, and our pitching can win with that. Appears that the shock of the move got some of the hitters moving, though really, Jeff Keppinger and Mark DeRosa has been hitting lately, and of course, Pablo Sandoval has usually been hitting. Fontenot had a nice game too, as did Chris Stewart, whom I've liked since he came up to the majors for us.
However, neither Carlos Beltran or Cody Ross did much of anything to help, though perhaps Ross is now afraid that Burrell will take his ABs away. Sigh: he should realize that it is his poor hitting that is taking away his ABs, not the OF situation, Bochy would start him a lot if he were hitting as well as he was for most of this season, and not the sad numbers he has put up since Beltran was traded for. Beltran has been hot for the most part lately, but have been coming up small when we needed him, like in yesterday's game, he could have tied the game with a base-hit and got us back in the game with a timely hit.
And, of course, Madison Bumgarner gave us a great game. Hopefully it is a start for the rotation, seems like a statement game by him: try and top this, ladies.
These are just my opinions. I cannot promise that I will be perfect, but I can promise that I will seek to understand and illuminate whatever moves that the Giants make (my obsession and compulsion). I will share my love of baseball and my passion for the Giants. And I will try to teach, best that I can. Often, I tackle the prevailing mood among Giants fans and see if that is a correct stance, good or bad.
Subscribe to:
Post Comments (Atom)
Labels
1984 Draft
(1)
2007 Draft
(15)
2007 Giants
(52)
2008 Draft
(22)
2008 Giants
(53)
2008 season
(6)
2009 Draft
(18)
2009 Giants
(87)
2009 season
(24)
2010 Decade
(12)
2010 Draft
(11)
2010 Giants
(137)
2010 NL ROY award
(1)
2010 season
(19)
2010's
(3)
2011 Draft
(9)
2011 Giants
(84)
2011 season
(8)
2012 Draft
(11)
2012 Giants
(93)
2012 season
(11)
2013 Draft
(3)
2013 Giants
(39)
2013 season
(5)
2014
(1)
2014 draft
(5)
2014 Giants
(79)
2014 season
(16)
2015 Draft
(4)
2015 Giants
(50)
2015 season
(10)
2016 Draft
(1)
2016 Giants
(45)
2016 season
(6)
2017 Draft
(3)
2017 Giants
(27)
2018 Draft
(8)
2018 Giants
(50)
2018 Season
(8)
2019 Draft
(1)
2019 Giants
(27)
2019 season
(2)
2020 Decade
(1)
2020 Giants
(9)
20201 Draft
(1)
2021 Giants
(3)
2022 Giants
(2)
2023 Giants
(14)
2023 season
(1)
2024 Giants
(18)
2025 Giants
(1)
25 man roster
(11)
25th man fallacy
(1)
26 man roster
(1)
3B
(1)
40 Man Roster
(11)
49ers
(1)
5-day rotation
(1)
51/49 decisions
(1)
6-man rotation
(5)
89 Quake
(1)
89 World Series
(1)
A-Ball
(1)
A-Gon
(1)
A-Rod
(3)
A's
(6)
AA-Ball
(1)
Aaron Rowand
(25)
Abiatal Avelino
(1)
accomplishments
(1)
ace pitcher
(2)
ace starter
(4)
Adalberto Mejia
(6)
Adam Duvall
(5)
AFL
(4)
aggression
(1)
AL Playoffs
(1)
Albert Suarez
(5)
Alen Hanson
(3)
Alex Cobb
(1)
Alex Dickerson
(2)
Alex Hinshaw
(3)
Alex Pavlovic
(1)
Alexander Canario
(2)
All-Star Game
(1)
almost perfect game
(1)
Alonzo Powell
(1)
Amphetamine
(3)
analysis
(24)
Andre Torres
(14)
Andres Torres
(2)
Andrew Baiiley
(1)
Andrew Bailey
(1)
Andrew McCutchen
(2)
Andrew Suarez
(5)
Andrew Susac
(11)
Andy Baggerly
(2)
Andy Sisco
(1)
Andy Suarez
(9)
Angel Joseph
(1)
Angel Pagan
(17)
Angel Villalona
(30)
Anniversary
(1)
appendicitis
(1)
Aramis Garcia
(2)
Arbitration
(19)
Armando Benitez
(5)
Armando Gallaraga
(1)
art of failure
(1)
Asia-Pacific signing
(1)
assessment
(1)
Astros
(3)
At the Rate They Are Going
(1)
ATT Park
(1)
Aubrey Huff
(20)
Austin Jackson
(2)
Austin Slater
(5)
Award
(4)
BABIP
(3)
Bam Bam Meulens
(1)
Barry Bonds
(30)
Barry Zito
(77)
baseball
(1)
Baseball America
(3)
Baseball Prospectus
(6)
Baseball Prospectus Bias Against Giants
(4)
baseball strategy
(9)
Baseball Study
(18)
baserunning
(2)
batting peripherals
(1)
batting stance analysis
(1)
batting title champion
(1)
Beat LA
(9)
bench players
(4)
Bengie Molina
(14)
Benjamin Snyder
(1)
Bert Blyleven
(1)
best manager
(2)
best practices
(2)
Beyond the Box Score
(1)
Bias Against Giants
(1)
Big 6
(9)
Big Picture
(3)
Bill Hall
(1)
Bill James
(1)
Bill James Handbook
(2)
Bill Mueller
(1)
Bill Neukom
(21)
Billy Beane
(3)
biography
(1)
Blake Riverra
(1)
Blake Snell
(1)
blog news
(3)
Blog Philosophy
(3)
Bob Howry
(2)
Bob Mariano
(1)
Bobby Evans
(4)
Boston Red Sox
(1)
Brad Hennessey
(5)
Brad Penny
(2)
Brandon Bednar
(1)
Brandon Belt
(50)
Brandon Crawford
(25)
Brandon Hicks
(1)
Braves
(5)
breakout
(2)
Brett Bochy
(4)
Brett Pill
(9)
Brewers
(1)
Brian Anderson
(1)
Brian Bannister
(3)
Brian Bocock
(2)
Brian Cooper
(1)
Brian Horwitz
(3)
Brian Ragira
(2)
Brian Sabean
(50)
Brian Wilson
(14)
Bridegrooms
(6)
Bruce Bochy
(36)
Bryce Eldridge
(2)
Bucky Showalter
(1)
bulllpen
(8)
Bullpen
(33)
Business Plan
(23)
Buster Posey
(103)
Byran Reynolds
(2)
Byung-Hyun Kim
(1)
Cained
(4)
call-ups
(3)
Candlestick Park
(1)
Cards
(13)
Career Prospects
(4)
Carl Hubbell
(1)
Carlos Beltran
(4)
Carlos Gomez
(1)
Carney Lansford
(2)
Carson Whisenhunt
(2)
Carter Jurica
(1)
Casey Kelly
(1)
Casey McGeHee
(3)
catcher injury
(5)
catching
(3)
CBT penalty
(1)
CC Sabathia
(1)
censorship
(2)
CEO
(2)
Chad Gaudin
(5)
Charles Culberson
(5)
Charlie Culberson
(3)
Chase Johnson
(3)
cheating
(1)
Chillax
(1)
Chris Brown
(1)
Chris Gloor
(1)
Chris Heston
(19)
Chris Lincecum
(1)
Chris Marrero
(1)
Chris O'Leary
(1)
Chris Ray
(4)
Chris Shaw
(4)
Chris Stewart
(4)
Chris Stratton
(30)
Chris Strattton
(1)
Christian Arroyo
(7)
Christmas
(1)
Christopher Dominguez
(4)
Christy Mathewson
(1)
Chuckie Jones
(2)
Clay Hensley
(3)
Clayton Blackburn
(10)
Clayton Tanner
(3)
Closer
(9)
closer by committee
(3)
Coaches
(4)
coaching changes
(1)
Cody Hall
(2)
Cody Ross
(8)
Col
(1)
Comeback Award
(1)
Commissioner
(1)
comparison
(3)
competitive advantage
(1)
Competitive Balance Tax
(2)
Competitive Cycles
(2)
competitiveness
(2)
Conner Menez
(1)
Connor Joe
(3)
Connor Nurse
(1)
Conor Gillaspie
(25)
contender
(1)
contract extension
(3)
contract negotiations
(2)
contract signing
(7)
Coordinator
(1)
core competency
(1)
Core Rotation
(1)
Cory Gearrin
(5)
Cory Guerrin
(1)
Cory Hart
(1)
Craig Whitaker
(2)
Cubs
(1)
Curt Young
(1)
cuts
(1)
Cy Young Award
(5)
cyber-relief
(1)
D-backs
(16)
D-gers
(36)
D-Rocks
(3)
D-Rox
(17)
D.J. Snelten
(3)
Dallas McPherson
(1)
Dan Ortmeier
(11)
Dan Otero
(2)
Dan Runzler
(6)
Dan Slania
(3)
Dan Uggla
(1)
Daniel Carbonell
(1)
Daniel Slania
(2)
Dany Jimenez
(1)
Darren Ford
(1)
Dave Righetti
(1)
Dave Roberts
(11)
David Aardsma
(1)
David Bell
(1)
David Huff
(2)
David Loewenstein
(1)
Decade of the Giants
(12)
decline
(1)
Defense
(11)
Deferred Money
(1)
deleted comment
(1)
Denard Span
(3)
depth
(1)
Dereck Rodriquez
(7)
Derek Holland
(18)
Derek Law
(11)
Detroit Tigers
(1)
DFA
(3)
DH
(2)
Dick Tidrow
(2)
dictionary
(1)
direction
(1)
Dirty
(1)
DL
(3)
dodgers
(15)
Donald Snelten
(1)
Donovan Solano
(1)
Draft
(11)
Draft Analysis
(28)
Draft Bonus
(7)
draft list
(3)
draft philosophy
(2)
draft signing
(3)
Draft Strategy
(12)
Draft Study
(9)
Draft Success
(4)
drafting
(5)
Dres
(16)
Drew Pomeranz
(1)
DRS
(1)
Dynasty
(3)
Earl Weaver
(1)
Edgar Renteria
(13)
Eduardo Nunez
(4)
Edwin Escobar
(5)
Ehire Adrianza
(26)
Eli Whiteside
(4)
Elimination game
(1)
EME
(2)
Emmanuel Burriss
(18)
end of an era
(1)
epic season
(6)
era
(1)
Eric Byrnes
(1)
Eric Surkamp
(6)
Erik Cordier
(1)
Eugenio Velez
(12)
evaluation
(3)
Evan Longoria
(3)
Evan Longoriia
(1)
extension
(7)
fan outrage
(10)
fan rants
(2)
fanfest
(1)
FanGraphs
(3)
Farhan Zaidi
(37)
feature reliever
(1)
felony conviction
(1)
Fielding
(5)
Fielding Stats
(4)
finger injury
(3)
first post-season press conference
(3)
Francisco Peguero
(4)
Fred Lewis
(3)
Freddie Lewis
(17)
Freddie Sanchez
(4)
Freddy Sanchez
(7)
Free Agency
(8)
free agent misses
(1)
Free agent possibilities
(28)
Free agent signing
(22)
Free agent signings
(21)
front office
(3)
Gabe Kapler
(1)
Game Score
(3)
gamer-tude
(1)
Garrett Williams
(1)
Gary Brown
(26)
Geno Espinelli
(1)
George Kontos
(10)
Ghosts of Giants Drafts
(2)
Giants
(10)
Giants Announcer
(1)
Giants blogs
(3)
Giants Chat
(4)
Giants Classic Rotation
(1)
Giants Defense
(4)
Giants Draft
(15)
Giants Drafts
(9)
Giants Farm System
(34)
Giants Franchise record
(2)
Giants Future
(66)
Giants GM
(12)
Giants Greats
(3)
Giants hitting manual
(1)
Giants Leadership
(1)
Giants manager
(1)
Giants No-Hitter
(5)
Giants Offense
(34)
Giants Offseason
(24)
Giants Pitching
(10)
Giants President of Baseball Operations
(4)
Giants Strategy
(44)
GiDar
(1)
Gino Espinelli
(1)
glossary
(1)
Gold Glove Award
(1)
good players
(4)
good will
(1)
Gorkys Hernandez
(2)
Graphical Player
(1)
great players
(4)
Gregor Blanco
(18)
Gregor Moscoso
(1)
Gregory Santos
(1)
Guillermo Moscoso
(2)
Guillermo Mota
(2)
Guillermo Quiroz
(1)
Gustavo Cabrera
(4)
Hall of Fame
(10)
Hall of Shame
(4)
Hank Aaron
(5)
Happy Holidays
(2)
Hate mail
(1)
Hayden Birdsong
(2)
healthy
(1)
heart-warming
(1)
Heath Hembree
(8)
Heath Quinn
(1)
Hector Correa
(1)
Hector Sanchez
(12)
Heliot Ramos
(13)
Henry Sosa
(8)
HGH
(1)
Hidden Game
(1)
high expectations
(1)
high school focus in draft
(1)
high velocity hitters
(1)
high velocity pitchers
(1)
hiring
(2)
hiring process
(1)
Hitter's League
(1)
Hitting
(19)
Hitting Coach
(1)
hitting mechanics
(3)
hitting pitchers
(2)
hitting streak
(1)
Hitting;
(1)
Home Run Career Record
(7)
Home Run Hitting Contest
(1)
Hunter Bishop
(4)
Hunter Pence
(25)
Hunter Stickland
(1)
Hunter Strickland
(9)
Ian Gardeck
(1)
Idea
(4)
IFA
(1)
improvement
(2)
Indictment
(1)
Infield
(1)
injury
(7)
instant replay
(2)
instructor
(1)
Interesting Question
(1)
International Free Agent Pursuits
(5)
International Signings
(5)
interview
(5)
Investment
(1)
Ivan Ochoa
(2)
J.P. Martinez
(1)
J2
(1)
Jack Taschner
(4)
Jackson Williams
(3)
Jacob Dunnington
(1)
Jacob Gonzalez
(2)
Jacob Junis
(1)
Jacob McCasland
(1)
Jae-gyun Hwang
(1)
Jake Dunning
(2)
Jake Peavy
(39)
Jake Smith
(1)
Jake Wong
(1)
Jalen Miller
(1)
Jandel Gustave
(1)
Japanese Starters
(1)
Jarrett Parker
(10)
Jason Heyward
(1)
Jason Maxwell
(2)
Jason Stoffel
(1)
Javier Lopez
(5)
JC Gutierrez
(3)
JD Davis
(1)
Jean Machi
(6)
Jeff Kent
(1)
Jeff Samardzija
(28)
Jeff Suppan
(1)
Jeremy Affeldt
(12)
Jeremy Shelley
(2)
Jerome Williams
(1)
Jesse English
(2)
Jesse Foppert
(1)
Jesus Guzman
(4)
Jimmy Rollins
(1)
Joaquin Arias
(14)
Joe Panik
(18)
Joe Torre
(1)
Joey Bart
(6)
Joey Martinez
(2)
Johan Santana
(1)
John Barr
(1)
John Bowker
(22)
John Thorn
(1)
Johneshwy Fargas
(2)
Johnny Bench
(1)
Johnny Cueto
(31)
Johnny Monell
(1)
Johnny Rucker
(1)
Jonah Arenado
(1)
Jonathan Mayo
(1)
Jonathan Sanchez
(49)
Jordan Hicks
(1)
Jordan Johnson
(1)
Jorge Soler
(2)
Jose Canseco
(1)
Jose Casilla
(1)
Jose Guillen
(3)
Jose Mijares
(3)
Jose Uribe
(2)
Josh Osich
(9)
JT Snow
(1)
Juan Perez
(6)
Juan Uribe
(9)
Juggling Monkey
(1)
Julian Fernandez
(7)
Julio Urias
(1)
Jung Hoo Lee
(4)
jury
(1)
Just Say No
(1)
Keaton Winn
(1)
Kelby Tomlinson
(5)
Kendry Flores
(2)
Keury Mella
(2)
Kevin Correia
(2)
Kevin Frandsen
(22)
Kevin Gausman
(3)
Kevin Pillar
(2)
Kevin Pucetas
(10)
KNBR
(1)
Kung Fu Panda
(30)
Kyle Crick
(16)
Kyle Harrison
(7)
laid off
(1)
Landen Roupp
(1)
Larry Baer
(3)
Larry Ellison
(1)
Lead-off
(2)
leadoff
(1)
left-handed
(1)
Lew Wolff
(1)
LHP
(1)
Lineup
(17)
lineup construction
(4)
Lineup position
(1)
links
(1)
Logan Webb
(3)
Lon Simmons
(1)
long relief
(2)
Long-Term Contract
(22)
long-term planning
(3)
losing streak
(1)
Lucius Fox
(3)
luck
(2)
Luis Angel Mateo
(2)
Luis Matos
(2)
Luis Toribio
(1)
lunatic fringe
(1)
Mac Marshall
(1)
Mac Williamson
(12)
Madison Bumgarner
(185)
Mailbox
(1)
Malcolm Gladwell
(1)
management change
(3)
management issues
(5)
managerial value
(5)
Manny
(1)
Marc Kroon
(2)
Marco Luciano
(4)
Marco Scutaro
(12)
Mark DeRosa
(8)
Mark Gardner
(1)
Mark Melancon
(4)
Marlon Byrd
(1)
Martin Agosta
(7)
Marvin Miller
(1)
Masahiro Tanaka
(1)
Mason Black
(1)
Mason McVay
(1)
Matsuzaka
(1)
Matt Cain
(160)
Matt Chapman
(2)
Matt Daniels
(3)
Matt Downs
(2)
Matt Duffy
(8)
Matt Graham
(1)
Matt Holliday
(1)
Matt Krook
(2)
Matt Moore
(15)
Matt Morris
(2)
Mauricio Dubon
(2)
Mechanics
(4)
Media
(17)
Media Bias
(17)
media hypocrisy
(1)
Media Trade Idea
(3)
Medical
(1)
Mediocy
(11)
Mediots
(6)
Melk-Gone
(1)
Melky Cabrera
(14)
Melvin Adon
(1)
memories
(1)
mental
(1)
Merkin Valdez
(8)
Message in a Bottle
(1)
methodology
(2)
MI
(1)
Michael Conforto
(1)
Michael Main
(1)
Michael Reed
(1)
Michael Trout
(1)
middle infield
(2)
Miguel Cabrera
(2)
Miguel Gomez
(1)
Miguel Tejada
(5)
Mike Fontenot
(3)
Mike Ivie
(1)
Mike Kickham
(9)
Mike Leake
(11)
Mike Matheny
(1)
Mike Morse
(10)
Mike Yastrzemski
(1)
Mike Yazstremski
(2)
milestone
(1)
minor league
(1)
minor league contract
(4)
minors
(11)
mismanagement
(1)
misnomer
(1)
mistakes
(2)
MLB
(2)
MLB stupidity
(2)
MLB Success
(7)
MLB Trade Rumors
(1)
MLBAM
(1)
MLBTR
(1)
MLE
(1)
Mock Draft analysis
(8)
Modern Portfolio Theory
(1)
Modus Operandi
(2)
MPT
(1)
MVP
(2)
Natanael Javier
(1)
Nate Schierholtz
(45)
Nathanael Javier
(1)
Nationals
(1)
Naysayers
(2)
Negotiations
(1)
Neil Ramirez
(1)
NewPQS
(8)
Next Gen
(1)
Nick Hundley
(2)
Nick Noonan
(27)
Nick Pereira
(1)
Nick Vander Tuig
(2)
Nick Vincent
(1)
NL Champions
(2)
NL Playoffs
(1)
NL West
(29)
NL West Division Title
(20)
NL West Future
(1)
NLCS
(22)
NLCS MVP
(2)
NLDS
(8)
Noah Lowry
(14)
non-roster invitees
(2)
non-tenders
(3)
Nori Aoki
(4)
NPB
(1)
NRI
(1)
Oakland A's
(4)
OBP
(1)
oddities
(1)
Offense
(4)
offensive era
(1)
ogcPQS
(6)
Omar Vizquel
(3)
one-run games
(3)
Opener
(1)
openers
(1)
Opening Day
(6)
opening day pitcher
(3)
opening day roster
(11)
Optimism
(1)
Osiris Matos
(2)
Outfield
(3)
outfielder curse
(1)
overturned
(1)
Ownership
(7)
Pablo Sandoval
(97)
Padres
(1)
Panda
(6)
Pandoval
(1)
passing
(1)
Pat Burrell
(15)
Pat Misch
(5)
Patrick Bailey
(2)
Payroll
(11)
PECOTA
(1)
Pedro Feliz
(12)
PEDS
(10)
Perfect Game
(2)
perjury trial
(1)
personal
(2)
Personal Reminiscence
(2)
Pessimism
(1)
Pete Palmer
(1)
Pete Putila
(1)
Pete Rose
(3)
Peter Magowan
(2)
Phil Bickford
(3)
Phillies
(7)
philosophy
(1)
Phoenix Theory of Rebuilding
(1)
Pierce Johnson
(2)
Pitch Count
(3)
pitch framing
(1)
pitch value
(1)
Pitcher hitting 8th
(1)
pitcher’s health
(1)
Pitchers League
(1)
Pitching
(27)
pitching analysis
(4)
pitching department
(1)
pitching development
(4)
Pitching Rotation
(90)
pitching staff
(6)
pitching strategy
(2)
plate discipline
(1)
platoon players
(2)
Play Ball
(1)
player acquisition
(1)
player budget
(2)
player development
(8)
playoff
(2)
playoff analysis
(6)
playoff hopes
(39)
playoff roster
(2)
playoff rotation
(6)
Playoff Success
(29)
Playoff Win Effective
(3)
Playoff Win Efficient
(2)
Playoffs
(44)
postmortem
(2)
PQS
(109)
press conference
(2)
pressure
(2)
priorities
(1)
Projected Record
(6)
projection
(2)
projections
(2)
promotion
(2)
prospect
(4)
prospect analysis
(7)
prospect future
(2)
prospect handling
(1)
Prospect of Note
(3)
prospect promotion
(1)
prospect study
(3)
Prospects
(46)
quality starts
(1)
questions
(1)
radio great
(1)
Rafael Rodriquez
(8)
Rajai Davis
(2)
Ralph Barbieri
(1)
Ramon Ramirez
(3)
Randy Johnson
(10)
Randy Messenger
(2)
Randy Winn
(14)
Rangers
(5)
Ranking
(4)
rant
(1)
raspberry
(1)
rationalization
(1)
Ray Durham
(5)
Rayner Arias
(1)
re-sign
(2)
realist
(1)
Rebuilding
(5)
Rebuilding Myths series
(1)
rebuttal
(1)
Red Sox
(1)
Reds
(5)
Reggie Crawford
(1)
rehab
(1)
reliever
(3)
relievers
(1)
Relocation Concession
(2)
Research
(2)
resource scarcity
(1)
rest for starters
(1)
Retired
(3)
Retirement
(3)
return
(1)
Reyes Moronta
(3)
RHP
(1)
Ricardo Genoves
(1)
Rich Aurilia
(7)
Rick Peterson
(1)
Rickie Weeks
(1)
Ricky Oropesa
(3)
right-handed
(1)
risk mitigation
(2)
risk profile
(1)
Roberto Gomez
(1)
Rockies
(2)
Rod Beck
(1)
Roger Kieschnick
(13)
Roger Metzger
(1)
Ron Shandler
(2)
Ron Wotus
(1)
Ronnie Jebavy
(1)
Ronnie Ray
(1)
rookie debut
(1)
Rookie of the Year
(1)
Roster
(4)
rosterbation
(2)
Rotation by Committee
(1)
Rotation Chaos
(1)
ROY
(2)
Royals
(3)
Rule 5
(2)
Rule 5 Draft Pick
(5)
rumors
(9)
run differential
(1)
run prevention
(1)
run production
(1)
runs support
(1)
Russ Ortiz
(11)
Russell Carleton
(1)
Ryan Garko
(2)
Ryan Klesko
(4)
Ryan Rohlinger
(2)
Ryan Theriot
(3)
Ryan Vogelsong
(93)
Ryder Jones
(2)
Sabean Naysayers
(7)
Sabermetric Thoughts
(6)
sabermetrics
(5)
SABR
(1)
Salary speculation
(3)
SALLY
(1)
Sam Dyson
(7)
Sam Long
(1)
Sam Selman
(1)
Sam Wolff
(1)
San Jose Giants
(1)
San Jose Relocation
(3)
Sandro Fabian
(2)
Sandy Rosario
(1)
Santiago Casilla
(9)
scenarios
(1)
Scott Boras
(1)
Scott Harris
(2)
Scott McClain
(2)
Scott Shuman
(1)
Scouting
(2)
Sean Hjelle
(5)
season review
(1)
secret sauce
(2)
Sergio Romo
(17)
Seth Corry
(6)
SF Giants
(2)
Shilo McCall
(1)
Shohei Ohtani
(3)
Shohei Otani
(2)
Shooter
(1)
shutouts
(1)
Signature Song
(1)
signing
(13)
Silly-Ball
(3)
South Atlantic League
(1)
South Bay Rights
(1)
SP usage
(1)
spin rate
(1)
splits
(2)
Sports Illustrated
(1)
Spring Training
(16)
stabilized stats
(1)
standings
(1)
starting CF
(1)
starting lineup
(19)
starting pitching
(96)
starting rotation
(5)
StatCast
(2)
Statcorner
(1)
State of the Giants
(1)
statistics
(2)
STATS
(1)
Steamer
(1)
Stephen Vogt
(1)
Steroids
(7)
Steve Edlefsen
(4)
Steve Johnson
(3)
Steve Okert
(8)
Steven Duggar
(7)
strikeout rate
(2)
Sue Burns
(1)
sunk costs
(1)
superstition
(1)
tactics
(1)
talent evaluation
(4)
Tax
(1)
team culture
(1)
Team of the 2010's
(2)
Team of the 2020's
(1)
Team of the Decade
(4)
Team Speed
(1)
Team Support
(1)
Thank You
(2)
The Evil Ones (tm)
(1)
The Giants Way
(2)
The Hardball Times
(1)
The Hey Series
(19)
The Hey Zaidi Series
(4)
Thomas Joseph
(3)
Thomas Neal
(9)
Tigers
(4)
Tim Alderson
(17)
Tim Hudson
(39)
Tim Lincecum
(195)
TINSTAAPP
(1)
Todd Linden
(3)
Todd Wellemeyer
(6)
Tommy Joseph
(3)
Tony Watson
(4)
Top 100 Prospects
(1)
Top 14 Roster
(1)
Top Draft Position
(4)
top Giants prospects
(6)
top player list
(1)
top prospect list
(6)
Trade
(12)
Trade Analysis
(22)
Trade Idea
(9)
Trade PTBNL
(2)
Trade Rumors
(30)
trading
(1)
training staff
(2)
Training Tool
(1)
transitional season
(1)
Travis Blackley
(1)
Travis Ishikawa
(47)
Trevor Brown
(5)
Trevor Gott
(1)
tribute
(1)
Tristan Beck
(2)
turning point
(1)
Ty Blach
(23)
Tyler Austin
(1)
Tyler Beede
(10)
Tyler Cyr
(1)
Tyler Horan
(1)
Tyler McDonald
(1)
Tyler Rogers
(2)
Tyler Walker
(2)
umpire mistake
(3)
Umpires
(3)
USA Today
(1)
utility
(1)
Voros McCracken
(1)
Waiver Roulette
(1)
Waldis Joaquin
(5)
walks
(1)
Wall of Fame
(1)
WAR
(4)
Warrior Spirit
(1)
Wendell Fairley
(10)
What-If Scenario
(3)
wild card
(1)
wild card race
(1)
Will Bednar
(1)
Will Clark
(1)
Will Smith
(7)
Will Wilson
(3)
Williams Jerez
(1)
Willie Mac Award
(1)
Willie Mays
(1)
winning on the road
(1)
Winter League
(1)
winter meetings
(3)
World Series
(28)
World Series Champions
(13)
WS Ring Bling
(1)
xBABIP
(1)
xwOBA
(1)
Yankees
(1)
Yusmeiro Petit
(40)
Zack Cozart
(2)
Zack Minasian
(1)
Zack Wheeler
(9)
Zaidi Haters
(1)
Zaidi MO
(2)
Zaidi Rotation
(3)
ZiPS
(1)
Zito Role
(2)
Gotta be kind sad to be not even worth a roster spot, re: Rowand. Tejada I can see, that was a calculated risk. But as you say, there's sunk costs and there's sunk costs - to be sunk 100% is rough.
ReplyDeleteA dumb question for you - okay, so it's September 1st, rosters expand to 40. Does a player have to be on the 40 man roster to be called up? I don't know why this never crossed my mind, but now it has. So, outside of the DL, the ML roster IS the 40 man roster? I never ever realized that. Or am I wrong?
Rowand is owed 2.26 mil. for Sept. of 2011 and 13.6 mil. for 2012 so The Giants must eat 15.86 mil. to say good bye to Rowand...
ReplyDeleteTejada is slightly over 1 mil. for Sept. of 2011 but,
Zito is owed 49 mil. as of September 1 2011... Why do Fans keep acting like The Giants can just eat this ?
If The Giants did Release Zito it would be the biggest Lost Salary contract in The History of Baseball ???
It's easy to say just cut him and pay him the 49 mil. when it's somebody elses money.
No team is going to trade for Zito because of the contract and his perfomance the last few years...
The Giants can't send him to The Minor Leagues without his permission ( that's in his contract )
The only realistic Hope for Zito that I can see is that The Giants should hire an Old Knuckleballer or even Tim Wakefield (if he retires ) this off season and have Zito learn a knuckle ball to go with his other pitches, then he could pitch Backwards using The Knuckler as his primary pitch and his Fastball and Curveball as out pitches.
He wouldn't be any worse off than he or the Giants are ?
marc, thanks for your comment. No dumb questions, I find, generally (usually it is dumb statements, and not by you, to be clear).
ReplyDeleteYes and no.
Yes, you have to be on the 40 man to be called up. Pill was not on, so he took, say, Rowand's spot. That leaves Tejada's spot open for the Giants to bring up, say, Kroon or Hall.
OK, maybe two yeses (one and a half?), after Sept 1st, the 40 man is the ML roster, basically, but the team does not have to bring up all 40 of them. And most teams do not. So technically, the major league roster is made up of the 25-man roster as of September 1st, plus any of the remaining 15 players on the 40-man roster that they call up.
Is that clear enough?
And I think Rowand was still worth a roster spot, but his bad attitude made him useless to us on our bench anymore. I think there will be another MLB team who will want him on their roster for 2012, he will be their Huff of 2010, a roll of the dice in case he can bring it.
Maybe he sill do more than ride a mountain bike to get fit this off-season and be ready next season. If he does and do well in 2012, the Giants still made the right decision, I think.
And as the Chronicle noted, Roawnd agreed that it was for the best for him to move, so he personally does not feel like he is a 100% sunk cost, he views himself as a diamond in the rough who is being kept down by the man Sabean and Bochy. He thinks once he gets out, he'll be OK again.
Not likely, particularly if he's bike riding again this off-season.
Hey, Anon, you are preaching to the choir!!!
ReplyDeleteI've been supporting keeping Zito for a number of years here already, especially after he figured out how to pitch well for us, in 2009 and 2010. That, despite what a lot of misguided fans think, was good pitching.
What it wasn't was worth the $20M or so that he was paid, but that is really a separate matter, which most fans lump together and co-mingle.
And as I've said many times before, it don't really matter how much we still owe Zito on the contract, what matters more is what he can do for us on our roster versus what we can minimally pay to do for us on our roster.
THAT is the proper way to do sunk costs, it has nothing to do with how much he is overpaid (again, something most fans lump in), but rather with what the better alternative is.
A low 4 ERA pitcher like Zito as our #5 starter is actually very very valuable. For us.
Dumping his contract so that we can, say, have the Wellemeyers and Suppans of the world as our #5 starter is stupid.
But now we have Lincecum, Cain, Bumgarner, Sanchez, and Vogelsong in the rotation. Zito is not as good as any of them. Again, don't matter how much he is paid, it only matters what the best rotation is.
And that is not really sunk costs in this instance, as Zito is still probably worth more than any replacement pitcher you can find in the free agent and trade market, but the problem now is that there is no spot for him in the rotation.
So unless the Giants go with a 6-man rotation, he will have no where to go except the bullpen, where he is not really suited, or the Giants finally release him or trade him away.
That is the only logical outcome I can come up with, if you have a better idea on how to resolve all that and not get rid of Zito, please share, but I assume your idea of teaching Barry the knuckle-ball is the best you got (since you note "the only realistic hope"), and I guess you don't know, but the knuckleball is one of the toughest pitches around to master.
From what I understand, your hands has be just right, and heck, Lance Niekro had two of the best ever, his uncle and dad, to teach him and he still hasn't made the majors yet as a knuckleballer. Zito will probably be done with his contract before he learns how to knuckleball.
The way I see it playing out is the Giants will probably seek a trade this off-season, either of Jonathan Sanchez or Barry Zito (with most of his salary covered by the Giants). If that don't happen, then they will all battle in spring training for a spot.
Assuming Zito loses, then if he at least pitched well, another team would probably take him off our hands as long as we pay most of his salary (leaving, say, $1-3M for the other team to pay) for a failed prospect or two.
And if he don't pitch well, then it would be logical to release him in that case, even if it is more money released in the history of baseball.
What matters is putting together the best rotation we can.
Thank you, OGC - somehow it hadn't occurred to me that those 15 players were the "pool". I more or less figured a team could call up anyone they felt like in September. Naturally, probably the same names, and of course I understand that the 40 man roster can change, but other than that, I didn't really get that. Thanks.
ReplyDeleteYeah, I think anonymous is more saying that unless Zito does something radically different he should go. A knuckleball is indeed insanely hard to throw, or more accurately, to throw where it knuckles regularly. Otherwise it's just the fattest, slowest fastball you ever saw. Every story I've ever heard about knuckleballers is that they always threw it, even if it was just for fun on the sidelines. You take Bouton, as I remember he could throw one as a kid, he just had no need for it in a game until he blew his elbow out and it was try that or retire.
I can just hear the howls at the gopher balls Zito would give up if he tried his brand-new knuckleball. I do think it takes years.
That's the thing Marc, Lance has been throwing it for fun on the side for a long time now, it's like the family business or something, and he was going to go to it full-time once his dream of being a position player failed.
ReplyDeleteSo he was already trying to do that his last few weeks with the Giants, then I think he went to Houston's farm system to try to make it there.
Yep, he was with Houston, but again as position player, then went to Atlanta's farm system in 2009 and finally did some serious pitching there, in the rookie league, and just got blasted there.
He has been out of organized baseball now for two seasons, making him 32 YO and unlikely to try to make it as a knuckleballer by now, one would think, unless he's going to pull a Salomon Torres resurrection act.
Oh, and you're very welcome. As Rory Paap once said about me, when asked about me, I just like to talk about the Giants.
And about Anon's comment, Marc, he in the first part is talking about how it would not make sense to drop Zito and the contract, that was what I was answering in my comments to him.
ReplyDeleteHe did then seem to talk about how Zito has nothing, so he appears to be one of the rare breeds: he thinks Zito cannot do anything yet he realizes that the Giants cannot necessarily just dump the huge contract.
I think a dump is possible now, whereas before I thought Zito was the best alternative, but Vogelsong has made him expendable. There is still a lot that could happen that could derail that possible scenario, though.