tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23735245.post2395862318744866661..comments2024-02-23T20:49:09.057-08:00Comments on obsessivegiantscompulsive: Letter to the Mailbox: What Happened?obsessivegiantscompulsivehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11362706004246875823noreply@blogger.comBlogger43125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23735245.post-48305991707805636932010-12-06T23:07:31.116-08:002010-12-06T23:07:31.116-08:00Also, it amazes me that jponry is allowed to be A ...Also, it amazes me that jponry is allowed to be A moderator on that site>. Countless times she has personally attacked posters, went to other teams sites to talk crap, and is in general an annoying assface. Doesn't surprise me she was the leader of the "Play Fred Lewis" brigade. Her baseball knowledge is non-existent.Pops123noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23735245.post-33704406690448295812010-12-06T23:04:58.293-08:002010-12-06T23:04:58.293-08:00Agreed with 22 Gigantes. MCC is more interested in...Agreed with 22 Gigantes. MCC is more interested in their LOL cats and general hate for either <br /><br />a)fans who are supportive of Giants management<br />and<br />b) Management in itself.<br /><br />OCG made an ill-advised comment, but then again, for all the work he puts into his posts, only to be made fun of constantly on MCC(before the NLCS comment), can anyone blame him for laughing at the doom-and-gloom crowd over there?Pops123noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23735245.post-33020670750000798842010-12-05T14:39:31.464-08:002010-12-05T14:39:31.464-08:00This was really fun. I just read through all of th...This was really fun. I just read through all of the comments here, then went over to MCC and read their comments on this subject (which is in the 100s by the way).<br /><br />OCG, you definitely ruffled their feathers (I know that was not your intent). <br /><br />Not one of them could dispute your arguments here (which I found to be quite valid). Instead, they resorted to irrelevant and predictably childish comments.<br /><br />I agree wholeheartedly with Dr.B's assessment about Grant being the alpha male. When Grant commented about banning giantsrainman by saying, "I would prefer not to ban him, actually, but I prefer taking the easy way out more ... Also, it was petty for me to remove the link. I did it when I was pissed, and I forgot I had done so" his main pup, jponry and another member of the pack, giant4life83, quickly came to his defense, with the latter saying, "nobodys perfect, don't even sweat it Grant." (Yet we all know that when anyone else is "not perfect" they are roasted like chestnuts on an open fire.)<br /><br />In my opinion, OCG is a site where mature, educated, and self-actualized Giants fans congregate to discuss baseball. MCC, on the other hand, attracts bitter, insecure people who must fulfill their basic need to gripe. <br /><br />Abraham Maslow, anyone?Troy Nelsonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13516303355440842602noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23735245.post-32630700207211962952010-12-04T16:39:11.904-08:002010-12-04T16:39:11.904-08:00I just saw this now. My apologies.
I did remove t...I just saw this now. My apologies.<br /><br />I did remove the link, and I did it out of anger. It was petty to do it, as GRM suggested, and it was a childish and stupid response. <br /><br />I was so incensed by your comment, though, that I thought, "Hey, if he hates us all so much, why would I link to his site?" Stupid in retrospect. And then I forgot that I did it until now. I hope there are no hard feelings.<br /><br />The post-NLCS comment that precipitated it was pretty repugnant, though. Reading between the lines, you wanted apologies because Andres Torres turned into Carlos Beltran. Think about it. Without that, there isn't a division title or a playoff run. I wanted Sabean to be replaced because he had no idea how to build an offense. I liked Sabean's ability to build a bullpen and a pitching staff, and I loved the young rotation he had built. My fear was that it was all going to be wasted because he didn't know how to build an offense. For five straight years, the Giants were at the bottom of the league in runs scored and OBP. Because of that, I criticized him. I wanted him to go. <br /><br />The Giants hit enough to win a championship. I didn’t expect that. It was beautiful. It turns out that – for 2010, at least –Sabean’s willingness to adapt was more important than how he evaluated hitters. But I shouldn’t have to accept Sabean’s methods of evaluation in order to enjoy the Giants. He thought Jose Guillen would help the offense, and if it weren’t for a surprise HGH investigation, we would have had the fruits of that evaluation right in our face for every playoff game. Would Guillen have hit as well as Ross throughout the playoffs? Well, I don’t know for sure, but…<br /><br />If a new GM had been the one to win a championship, I sincerely doubt that I would have come here to chide you for supporting a GM who pretended that Dan Ortmeier was a legitimate option to start at first base. That’s why I was so upset. It felt really, really petty, and it felt like it was a personal attack on me.<br /><br />Regardless, go Giants, and I still like you and your site, and I’m pretty embarrassed about Linkgate. It was a crime of passion, what can I say?Grantnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23735245.post-15833555949371266542010-12-04T16:31:04.773-08:002010-12-04T16:31:04.773-08:00And to Dr. B: I miss you and your contributions to...And to Dr. B: I miss you and your contributions to McC. Come back! Just wanted to clarify a couple of things. You wrote:<br /><br /><i>Here's a scenario. Grant, the Alpha Male of MCC makes a statement like, "hey, look at Fred Lewis! He has the second best OBP on the team and his UZR says he's a much better fielder than most people who have watched him play think. I think the Giants should try Fred Lewis as the starting left fielder." And, Grant makes that and similar comments repeatedly. </i><br /><br />I was never big on Lewis. The first sentences of my Lewis-was-gone post were "It seemed weird that this site was one of the main hubs for Fred Lewis love. I liked the guy, sure, but I never thought of him as anything more than a fourth outfielder." Also, I'm a total sissy. Hardly an alpha-male.<br /><br />Second, you wrote:<br /><br /><i>I mean, it got so ridiculous at one point that there was a post seriously theorizing that the only stat Sabean looks at is RBI's.</i><br /><br />If you can make an argument for Jose Guillen without RBI, I'd like to read it. Maybe not RBI, per se, but the general feeling that Player X is a "middle-of-the-order hitter." I know the Giants employ sabremetricians. I also know that Sabean doesn't have to listen to them, and when it comes to players like Guillen, I don't think he does.Grantnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23735245.post-85284617890474016532010-12-04T16:14:10.889-08:002010-12-04T16:14:10.889-08:00I just saw this now. My apologies.
I did remove t...I just saw this now. My apologies.<br /><br />I did remove the link, and I did it out of anger. It was petty to do it, as GRM suggested, and it was a childish and stupid response. <br /><br />I was so incensed by your comment, though, that I thought, "Hey, if he hates us all so much, why would I link to his site?" Stupid in retrospect. And then I forgot that I did it until now. I hope there are no hard feelings.<br /><br />The post-NLCS comment that precipitated it was pretty repugnant, though. Reading between the lines, you wanted apologies because Andres Torres turned into Carlos Beltran. Think about it. Without that, there isn't a division title or a playoff run. I wanted Sabean to be replaced because he had no idea how to build an offense. I liked Sabean's ability to build a bullpen and a pitching staff, and I loved the young rotation he had built. My fear was that it was all going to be wasted because he didn't know how to build an offense. For five straight years, the Giants were at the bottom of the league in runs scored and OBP. Because of that, I criticized him. I wanted him to go. <br /><br />The Giants hit enough to win a championship. I didn’t expect that. It was beautiful. It turns out that – for 2010, at least –Sabean’s willingness to adapt was more important than how he evaluated hitters. But I shouldn’t have to accept Sabean’s methods of evaluation in order to enjoy the Giants. He thought Jose Guillen would help the offense, and if it weren’t for a surprise HGH investigation, we would have had the fruits of that evaluation right in our face for every playoff game. Would Guillen have hit as well as Ross throughout the playoffs? Well, I don’t know for sure, but…<br /><br />If a new GM had been the one to win a championship, I sincerely doubt that I would have come here to chide you for supporting a GM who pretended that Dan Ortmeier was a legitimate option to start at first base. That’s why I was so upset. It felt really, really petty, and it felt like it was a personal attack on me.<br /><br />Regardless, go Giants, and I still like you and your site, and I’m pretty embarrassed about Linkgate. It was a crime of passion, what can I say?Grantnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23735245.post-17543479146282208922010-11-18T16:48:54.565-08:002010-11-18T16:48:54.565-08:00Also, so that they don't feel that I overlooke...Also, so that they don't feel that I overlooked them, I wanted to say thanks to marc, steveb, and M.C. O'Connor. I just didn't have anything to add in response, but I greatly appreciated your feedback.obsessivegiantscompulsivehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11362706004246875823noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23735245.post-27292390196177149552010-11-18T16:47:29.699-08:002010-11-18T16:47:29.699-08:00As far as agreeing to disagree, Boof, for me, it i...As far as agreeing to disagree, Boof, for me, it is all degrees. There are plenty of things I will let go. I just felt very strongly that the Giants had something very good building up and wanted everyone to understand that.<br /><br />I have learned from past interactions with groups that going with the flow and consensus just ends up poorly if you feel you know the right decision. <br /><br />For example, I was in this business war game simulation once with strangers, and I saw and understood the math of it and pushed for the best decision but was outvoted, but I decided to agree to disagree. When the results were announced, it turned out that what I suggested was right and the group said, "hey you were right" but still, we lost.<br /><br />Another time, I got face time with the big boss of the company in a group, had an idea, but the group didn't care/understand it, but then the ideas the group came up with he didn't care for all that much. We had a small window to speak later and I went with another idea that I knew the group would like instead of the idea that I thought the boss would like. He didn't think much of that either. Maybe my idea would have still been dismissed, but I should have went for what I thought was a better answer, took that risk.<br /><br />And not that I'm perfect, I know I can and will be wrong. But if I feel something to be right, from my analysis, I feel I must go all in on it. As I noted, I have to have a lot of evidence before I go strongly on one position or another. So it is not something I take lightly. <br /><br />As an analyst, I need to know the degree of certainty I feel about any particular position and decision. I just felt very strongly about the Giants rebuilding efforts.<br /><br />I agree that discussing with people who have opposing opinions is good. That is part of the reason why I went out to other sites and put my opinions out there, see how it falls out. Then I put the best ones here. :^)<br /><br />But it got very tiring after a while, particularly when I didn't feel that I'm being understood, or worse, I was pigeon-holed and labeled a "pollyanna" or "cherry-picker" or "blind supporter" or whatever. I see the comments and snickers, it is not like I can't see their comments, I am right there in the virtual room with them.<br /><br />If I feel strongly that I'm right, I am not going to agree to disagree, but I will approach my position from many different angles to see if there is anything I'm missing, that would change my position. That is part of the reason why I go out and repeat myself, maybe someone else will find that crack in my arguments. I know I have been wrong before, I know I have missed something before.<br /><br />That's part of the OCD, I remember a lot of my mistakes, and would scourge myself with the memory of these mistakes. Luckily, I'm blessed with a absent-minded professor memory, so if I don't repeat the mistake, it won't stick to my memories and fade away. <br /><br />I've also gotten soft with age too. :^)<br /><br />Well, softer at least.<br /><br />In any case, I can let some things go and agree to disagree, if I don't feel I have a lot of evidence to support my position. But if I do, then that's when I obstinately hold to my position.obsessivegiantscompulsivehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11362706004246875823noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23735245.post-67255772170003468442010-11-18T16:46:46.892-08:002010-11-18T16:46:46.892-08:00Thanks for the comment Boof.
I have no problem wi...Thanks for the comment Boof.<br /><br />I have no problem with balance, I know that the Giants would win a lot more games with that and our pitching. It is the cost to get that balance that I have had a problem with. <br /><br />Most ideas I've seen required losing one of our starting pitching, because that is the cost of getting balance. I think most would agree that without our pitching, we would not have gone no where as far as we did. Whereas we picked up the offense off the slag heap on the cheap.<br /><br />That is exactly been my point, that the offense can be cobbled together and we can win with that.<br /><br />Besides, most of the trade ideas I've seen had the Giants giving up one of their ace-worthy pitchers for a hitter who either was not an equally great player or had many less years of control. Basically over pay to get that offense. <br /><br />I have no problem trading if we get value back (as I commented back to you on my most recent post). I just never saw such an idea that makes sense for the other team to do. I had a high sense of what the worth of Sanchez and others were.<br /><br />Even your idea of trading Sanchez for Jose Reyes, I would do that, he is a premier offensive player who is still young, I just don't see the Mets going for that, they will have a lesser opinion of Sanchez and any prospects we give up, unless we give up Belt, but I'm not trading him either, that's too much for Reyes.obsessivegiantscompulsivehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11362706004246875823noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23735245.post-12134433564253956512010-11-18T15:29:53.299-08:002010-11-18T15:29:53.299-08:00As you know, I have been one of Sabean's detra...As you know, I have been one of Sabean's detractors for a long time. I have been on this site debating with you the relative pros & cons of his administration. One thing I do have to say about Sabean this season is that he did make a series of very good moves during the season that changed the type of team that he started with. The shoring up of the bullpen and the addition of Ross & others (not so much Guillen) were exactly what the Giants needed to get over the hump. So I have to give Sabean credit for being savvy enough to make the moves necessary to get over the hump without mortgaging the future. In the past, he has had a problem with that.<br /><br />I maintained in my arguments that you need balance between pitching, defense & offense to be successful. You have consistently maintained that pitching & defense is really all that's necessary, especially when you get to the playoffs. In the end, we are both somewhat correct, in that the good pitching & defense carried us and gave us a decided advantage in the playoffs. But I am also partially correct that the balance in offense is also necessary, as we almost didn't make the playoffs, even with the mid-season moves to improve. In any case, who cares? The Giants won the crown and isn't that what really counts?<br /><br />One of the reasons that I comment here more often than anywhere else is that I can debate points with you and, in the end, not agree with you and it is OK as far as I am concerned. On the flip side, I think you have a problem with agreeing to disagree. It just doesn't sit right with you because you are convinced that your opinion is right.....and there is nothing wrong with that either. I think the difference between us is that I have an easier time accepting that, whereas you may feel that, by not convincing me, that you have failed somehow, when in reality that is not the case.<br /><br />As I've said to you before, don't take the fact that you can't convince everyone to agree with you as a failure on your part. I, for one, like to discuss things with people who don't necessarily agree with me. Discussion wouldn;t be much fun if we all had the same opinion.Boofnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23735245.post-40654522492287170452010-11-18T14:48:47.767-08:002010-11-18T14:48:47.767-08:00Thanks for the comment "Is a Giants Fan"...Thanks for the comment "Is a Giants Fan", though I'm not sure why you then deleted it. But just wanted to say thank you anyway, much appreciated.obsessivegiantscompulsivehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11362706004246875823noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23735245.post-34630655034220788952010-11-18T14:40:28.674-08:002010-11-18T14:40:28.674-08:00Side thought/observation: any of you still crying...Side thought/observation: any of you still crying over the victory? Smiling at sudden moments? <br /><br />Funny thing is that I get all emotional when I hear Fleming's call but not so much Kuiper's, though I love hearing it, over and over again, I recorded it off internet onto my phone. When I got time while wife shops, I play it back and relive the moment.obsessivegiantscompulsivehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11362706004246875823noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23735245.post-78524392667414589052010-11-18T14:30:08.300-08:002010-11-18T14:30:08.300-08:00Speaking of Freddie Lewis, I have had this post ha...Speaking of Freddie Lewis, I have had this post half written about his "great" season and expose what others had been refusing to see.<br /><br />Sure, the points are cherry picked to some extent, if you want to call it that: I call it analyzed to see how consistently he was hitting, because no matter how good your stats look like at the end of the season, if you are crap 75% of the time, I don't care how good your stats look like at the end of the season, you are hurting the team on an overall basis.<br /><br />While I know that there are limitations to slicing up the season stats because of SSS, there is just as great a limitation to looking at someone's overall season stats and saying that he's good or bad. That works if you are going to comb through 1,000's of players and try to find something general to say about players in general, but I think it fails when you are looking at one specific player.<br /><br />Slicing up data, at that point, if done right, illuminates. <br /><br />I know one reason why MCCers berate me for this is because I used that to say that Frandsen and Ortmeier deserves chances to start.<br /><br />But what I found is that people just like to take your idea broadly and focus on one detail of it - "Frandsen and Ortmeier deserves chances to start" - and ignore the nuance I put on that: neither will be great but at this point of the team's re-building process the Giants are better off giving young guys a chance to start than signing veterans who can hit. If they hit, then great, but if they fail, well, we lose a lot of games and get a better draft pick. Win-win.<br /><br />I know that is one the flashpoints where that impression of me began, which drove me crazy at the time, but I eventually moved on, and that is probably when I started not going as often over there. I still have MCC RSSed, and when Grant has an interesting post, I go over, but the fanposts just drove me crazy. <br /><br />So I'm glad that DrB turned me on to Fla-Giants' great posts on prospects, I know I'm missing out, but for my sanity, I have to put some limits. So if you see anything good, feel free to let me know, it would be greatly appreciated.<br /><br />Another example, true story: someone on radio has stupid idea, so I blog about how stupid it is, then somebody blogs that I had this stupid idea and ripped me a new one! Sigh... I wrote asking for a public apology but I guess I was asking for too much civility and ethical responsibility...obsessivegiantscompulsivehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11362706004246875823noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23735245.post-89909742244945261342010-11-18T12:30:20.791-08:002010-11-18T12:30:20.791-08:00And to DrB's comment, yes, that is exactly why...And to DrB's comment, yes, that is exactly why I was bullish on this team too. <br /><br />Thinking that they would win it all this season was hoping for too much when we have waited for 52 years (as a city), but I've been saying for a while that this is the Giant's decade, they will make the World Series multiple times and that we would eventually win one this decade. That it happened this season is still an joy to me.<br /><br />But it was not a surprise, from the way I analyzed it, they have the foundation of pitching to do it, but as Matt aptly notes, it is a crapshoot. Instead of Brooks Conrad, it was Candy Maldonaldo long ago. You never know who will win. <br /><br />But based on the most recent knowledge and studies on baseball, I felt that the Giants had the ingredients to do this eventually with this core of pitching.<br /><br />And to DrB's point, if we return to mediocrity soon, I think it's time to change GMs. That's why I made a point before of stating that while I was happy that Sabean got an extension, two years was all he got from me and he had to deliver some good progress before he gets another extension.<br /><br />He has everything he needs now. We should be battling for the playoffs every season now as long as the young core is kept together. Neukom appears ready and willing to do that, damn the budget (still has to do it first...). This winning arc should last a while, and if Sabean stumbles extensively with it, then he should be gone.<br /><br />But I think winning it all once buys him some time to screw up a little.obsessivegiantscompulsivehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11362706004246875823noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23735245.post-84896003470804189102010-11-18T12:15:47.300-08:002010-11-18T12:15:47.300-08:00Frankcontreras, yes I think that makes a lot sense...Frankcontreras, yes I think that makes a lot sense, put in a much better way than I could have.<br /><br />Heck, in a way that I didn't even capture lately. People don't realize that rebuilding is a process, and that trading the young players before they "ripened" would only short-circuit the process. Impatience was a word I was searching for.<br /><br />That's why I like to point out the Atlanta Braves under Bobby Cox as GM, then manager. He put them through 6 seasons of agonizingly poor teams, but that netted him the key players that fueled 17 (or whatever it is) years of playoff baseball. If he had given in earlier, like I'm sure a lot of Braves fans did (much like Giants fans), they would have never gotten the pick in their 5th season of shame that allowed them to pick up Chipper Jones.<br /><br />I wrote on this before, but I view Posey as our Chipper Jones pick, the offensive guy who will stir the Giants drink (to borrow from Reggie Jackson) for years to come.<br /><br />An apt analogy for this is the use of anti-biotics. When the doctor prescribes antibiotics the patient needs to follow the whole process. If they cut it short, the bugs just get stronger, and you might go through it all again only worse.<br /><br />That's why all these super-germs are starting to crop up, people take their meds but stop once they start feeling good, when they need to go through the whole treatment to kill the germs. Else, the germs are then weakened but not killed, and go on to make other people even sicker.<br /><br />A team is like that. It needs to go through their losing years to get the good draft picks that allow the team to become good again. That's my Phoenix Theory of Re-building. <br /><br />Short-circuit that by trading away guys before they develop (or worse, make the wrong assessment and trade away good players, like Rangers did with Hafner and A-Gon, and now I bet A's with Car-Gon) and you just doom yourself to a return to losing sooner than later, as that weakens the team for a short-term fix.<br /><br />Yes, frankcontreras, you make a lot of sense.obsessivegiantscompulsivehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11362706004246875823noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23735245.post-79584096986507802272010-11-18T12:00:50.741-08:002010-11-18T12:00:50.741-08:00DrB, what I meant by them being humans is that thi...DrB, what I meant by them being humans is that this put a higher level of responsibility on the part of the complainer to have all their facts straight when they are advocating for the GM being fired, and to admit that they were wrong if they turn out to be wrong.<br /><br />And that's to your point in the following paragraph.<br /><br />And yes, I agree, I think the Giants have shown very strong abilities in the evaluation of pitching.obsessivegiantscompulsivehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11362706004246875823noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23735245.post-21045929067746012552010-11-18T11:57:30.865-08:002010-11-18T11:57:30.865-08:00And to clarify DrB, I didn't post my comment a...And to clarify DrB, I didn't post my comment after winning the World Series, I posted it after we won the NLCS. I figured that getting to the World Series, after demolishing the mightly Phillies, was the right time to do it.<br /><br />Because, after the World Series, we would be either in ecstacy or in mourning, and either way, it did not seem as right as right then, when the Giants accomplished something that none of the people who wanted Sabean fired thought they would see again under Sabean's regime, getting into the World Series.<br /><br />I thought that they had accomplished enough to call them out on it, and as I noted, afterward, wouldn't have made much sense either way.<br /><br />To DrB's point, I'm sure a lot of the comments were tongue-in-cheek, but they just emboldened the ones who were serious about that point, and just made it a free for all complaining about Sabean and asking for his firing.<br /><br />And as he noted, they have had 2 sabers in-house, and that is like Sabean, wanting to keep everything under his kimono, so I'm glad Neukom realized that they needed to counter that image by revealing that they do use sabers and to good effect. I agree, I think they must have been ahead of the curve on defensive metrics.<br /><br />And that will continue, I read this somewhere, a company is testing out equipment at AT&T that will take every hit ball and capture all sorts of stats regarding how well it was hit, at what angle, and so on, in order to better evaluate how fielders handle balls hit to them (plus I would imagine you can analyze the hitters too).obsessivegiantscompulsivehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11362706004246875823noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23735245.post-16085592684029127092010-11-18T11:44:28.651-08:002010-11-18T11:44:28.651-08:00And less crowing?
This is the time to do it: the...And less crowing?<br /><br />This is the time to do it: the San Francisco Giants are the freaking World Champions of baseball!!! If not now when?obsessivegiantscompulsivehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11362706004246875823noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23735245.post-72482351247826002432010-11-18T11:43:00.498-08:002010-11-18T11:43:00.498-08:00And I know I'm not saying it right, but this a...And I know I'm not saying it right, but this attitude of "Yeah, he should be fired, but I'm going to enjoy that his strategy succeeded" bothers me greatly. It minimalizes the team's achievement. <br /><br />They won the f'ing World Series! But, "oh, it was just luck." Really? Is that how people view this?<br /><br />Just makes me sad. This was an awesome achievement, even if they don't ever come close again. They stood up when they had to, many times, day in, day out, they manned up and got the job done when they needed to, whether it be Renteria's homer, the pitching staff's GREAT string of games, the relievers shutting down people, or the hitters who delivered when needed most. Luck?<br /><br />Just makes me sick...obsessivegiantscompulsivehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11362706004246875823noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23735245.post-22808973118569863862010-11-18T11:37:30.138-08:002010-11-18T11:37:30.138-08:00Matt, again, wrong impression, and I take some bla...Matt, again, wrong impression, and I take some blame for that with my initial comment. But every one after that I made it clear that it was directed towards those who wanted him fired.<br /><br />I agree, no GM can escape criticism. Just like no fan can escape criticism. He had a plan, he executed it, sure the playoffs is a crapshoot, but did the GM put the team in position to maximize their opportunity to win it all?<br /><br />I've been writing about that for years now, it's in my business plan, BP and THT studied how to maximize your chances of going deep in the playoffs: both agreed that it is good pitching and good fielding. Great offenses offer no advantage in the playoffs, both studies showed, and I think the way the Giants blasted through all the good offensive teams shows the truth in that, if not the 2002 Giants failure to win because their pitching was not good enough when they were needed.<br /><br />BP even went further on that, asking why Billy Beane's sh*t don't work in the playoffs (yes, they used that word in their chapter title). BP found that teams that go deep have a high K/9 pitching staff, a high WRXL closer, and a good fielding team. Even though this was written years ago, Billy still don't get it, his pitchers are all low K/9 pitchers for the most part (heck, they released Casilla) and he still thinks closers are fungible assets easily replaced. I guess he lied, BP should take his quote off their books, the one study they did of his teams and he still don't follow it.<br /><br />Meanwhile, whether the Giants intended to do it or not, the Giants have put together a team that fits BP's description of a team maximizing their chances in the playoffs (nothing guarantees success, it is all degrees)<br /><br />Sabean put the team in position to grab for the gold ring, I think that is a vindication of his agenda. Even if they didn't win (but they did, WEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!! Giants World Champs!!!) it would have been a vindication, everyone that thought he should be fired didn't even think that the Giants would even make the playoffs.<br /><br />And I know they are lording over the fact that they won on the last day. Enough! They won, isn't that enough?<br /><br />So yes, criticism should always be OK, but it goes both ways, fans can be criticized too. And I have no problem with fans wanting a GM's ouster, I've done that plenty of times (Haller, Richardson, etc.), I just have a problem with people not admitting that they were wrong when they were wrong, yet are enjoying the fruits of being wrong.obsessivegiantscompulsivehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11362706004246875823noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23735245.post-79826931814582299562010-11-18T11:34:06.705-08:002010-11-18T11:34:06.705-08:00I think there are two issues here, one that has be...I think there are two issues here, one that has been addressed appropriately and another that seems to be getting ignored. The first issue is whether people who demanded that Sabean be fired should do a "Mea Culpa" for their transgressions. The second issue (which hasn't been addressed) is whether a link to a blog should be taken out of a Giants community website for making that demand in a discussion forum. <br /><br />I personally find it a little sickening that this website was taken out of the link section in McCovey Chronicles for a couple of reasons. The first, and most obvious reason is that I'm not really sure what standards were evoked to make that decision (unless there are none?). If it was a violation in code of conduct or terms of conditions, it seems to be a very liberal interpretation of those rules. If there are no standards in removing the link, then it was removed because the webmaster deemed his comments offensive and/or inappropriate, especially in a moment of glory. In otherwards, the website brought confirmation to our biggest fears of a politically correct world, say something that big brother doesn't like, and you will be punished. <br /><br />Another reason I dislike the removal of the link is that I personally think that this website is one of the best Giants blogs on the web. Even for people who disagree with OGC, they have to admit that he's one hell of a writer, and puts many professional sports writers to shame. Too many blogs linked in MCC are not well written, not updated frequently, etc. Doesn't it make sense, if you are webmaster of a community website like MCC, to link to blogs that are good, even if you disagree with them? <br /><br />As far as a Mea Culpa over demanding the firing of Sabean, I will admit that I have been skeptical of his practices over the years. I especially grew tired of the Giants building a team around Bonds when it was obvious that a paradigm change was needed. And by 2009, by emphasizing pitching, it was clear that Sabean had done his part in changing the paradigm himself. In fact, I think I fell into a dominant paradigm that many fans have, fire the boss when things aren't working. But Sabean had proven that he could be successful before, and the Giants did the right thing by allowing him to adapt and change his management philosophies. So, I'm happy to do a Mea Culpa! Also, the Fire Sabean website is gone and they are changing the name, so that says something...Tommy Wiseau Is A Giants Fannoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23735245.post-89085323950731764492010-11-18T11:20:14.291-08:002010-11-18T11:20:14.291-08:00Matt no, you didn't come off as a jerk. You s...Matt no, you didn't come off as a jerk. You said what you had to say without going in my face about it, as some have done on MCC. I appreciate it.<br /><br />About cherry-picking, perhaps I should not have done that until I was better at doing that, but I think that is a viable analysis tool. I think I'm better at doing that today, but it's an art and I'm not always going to be right, but I still think it is useful.<br /><br />Besides, it is better to see the insides of the stats than just looking at the overall numbers. That goes for all the people who think the Giants standing still means a team that barely won the division title (my next post), and as DrB aptly noted, those who think Freddy Lewis was too good to let go.<br /><br />Let's look at Freddy (who hates this name; I lost all respect for him after his homo-phobic rant on twitter/facebook during the season). People touted his overall numbers and blasted me for cherry-picking his numbers. But the fact was that his overall numbers were greatly boosted by two weeks of great hitting followed by 6-8 weeks of sucky hitting that those same fans would have buried him deep on the bench for. And really, that is the pattern of his career, he gets hot, fans think he's the greatest since sliced bread, then he sucks for a looong time, but hey, his overall OBP looks really shiny and good, when his OBP is crap for 6 out of 8 weeks.obsessivegiantscompulsivehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11362706004246875823noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23735245.post-10806572992961239752010-11-18T11:11:01.065-08:002010-11-18T11:11:01.065-08:00Matt, your impression of me couldn't be more w...Matt, your impression of me couldn't be more wrong, at least from my viewpoint. I feel like I'm the messenger being killed, and that could be partly my fault too, perhaps I don't make myself clear enough.<br /><br />I view my "job", if you will, to provide the view that isn't being represented on other boards. As I noted above, I tend to see things from many perspectives.<br /><br />And as any of us can attest, the management's view is sorely lacking most of the time.<br /><br />SO, I attempt to show that there was some logic behind the moves of the Giants, and I don't know how many times I had to also put in there, "however, I feel this", and I know I don't always do that because it's tiring, I seem to get lumped as a "management can do no wrong" person.<br /><br />I was against a lot of the things that most fans were against, Rowand, Zito, others, but I could understand the logic behind the moves, it was just that they were taking on risks that I would not have done. And I could have joined in the bashing afterward but thought that it would be more helpful to see why the Giants could have thought to make such a deal and why the deal might still work.<br /><br />If Zito would have pitched for Giants like he did for the A's at the end of his career there, like he did in 2010, his contract would have made some sense. But the risk of it all going bad was just so great. But they were looking for someone to market after Bonds, so that was part of the equation too.<br /><br />If Rowand had hit like he did before when going well, he would have been worth every penny. Unfortunately, he lasts for 2-8 weeks then is horrible. Hopefully he watched Huff, Huff was out of shape too and actually did reshape his body during the off-season (former coach noted this in spring training), unlike Rowand, who realized he needed off-season program, but then did it by riding his mountain bike. If Rowand would actually get into shape, he might just yet earn his 2011 and 2012 pay, but it's too late now for saving the overall contract, unless he hits .400 or something crazy like that.obsessivegiantscompulsivehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11362706004246875823noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23735245.post-89754653645402291282010-11-18T10:46:30.365-08:002010-11-18T10:46:30.365-08:00To Matt's point, yeah, it is outrageous, but i...To Matt's point, yeah, it is outrageous, but it is not as outrageous as advocating for the firing of Sabean when they didn't have the full story and then they wimp out on acknowledging that maybe they got it wrong.<br /><br />As EL said, it is a vindication of his agenda. Otherwise, you are saying that teams can win the World Series on luck alone, that there were no strategy he took that led to this shining moment.<br /><br />And he did have a strategy: pitching, pitching, and even better pitching. I wrote on this in 2003 when I was first blogging on Yahoo, and the strategy has slowly come to fruition.<br /><br />The problem is that people see the "luck" in the hitting that led us to the championship. Every team that wins the championship have some element of luck in them winning it all. Should we trash all the previous champions? Should we just have each team roll a pair of dice and see who wins?<br /><br />But was it luck that we had the pitching and fielding that we had? Does one accidentally put together a team defense that is among the top in the majors two years in a row? And probably will be that for the foreseeable future, barring injury? That is from the strategy that Sabean executed for the Giants.obsessivegiantscompulsivehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11362706004246875823noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23735245.post-58049990982308522492010-11-18T10:15:54.871-08:002010-11-18T10:15:54.871-08:00Thanks for all the comments, everyone. I apprecia...Thanks for all the comments, everyone. I appreciate them all.<br /><br />And I wasn't trying to take credit and say "I was right and you were wrong." For that I take responsibility for in my comment on MCC. It distracted from my main point, which I was on point with every comment after that, which is that people openly wanting Sabean fired should do a mea culpa.<br /><br />It goes back to Boof's string of comments discussion with me early in this season. I was basically depressed that people didn't see the potential of the Giants and I felt bad that my lack of ability to convey that potential properly were preventing people from enjoying a good team, a good season. It was very frustrating. I think that is part of why I write so much, because I have trouble conveying exactly what I feel, so I try to be as detailed as I can.<br /><br />And, well, I can see things from many different points of view.<br /><br />I have this irrational need to worry and care about other people and I know that is good generally, but I think my OCD pushes it to extremes. I have had incidences in the past where I was greatly worried about people and the reaction was "oh, that's cute, but you needed do it, it's OK."<br /><br />So I guess I was frustrated at that point that these people wanted him fired when it was leading up to this beautiful thing, why didn't they listen to me?<br /><br />And so I asked for a mea culpa.obsessivegiantscompulsivehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11362706004246875823noreply@blogger.com